2. Beyond the Snap, Crackle and Pop w/ Dr. Calla Jayne Kleene

Dr. Calla Jayne Kleene 0:03

there's times where like there's something crazy going on with this patient and I just adjust the spine to maybe put two acupuncture needles in or do a little bit of soft tissue. And the patient says this was a game changer and it humbles me just the power of when the body is alive and the nervous system is working. Just how sometimes the simplest things when we have super complex patients can make profound effects long term.

Dr. Stephanie Gray 0:26

Welcome to the longevity blueprint podcast, I'm your host, Dr. Stephanie gray. My number one goal with the show is to help you discover your personalized plan to build your dream health and live a longer, happier, truly healthier life. You're about to hear from a great friend of mine Dr. Keller Jean clean. I wanted to start this podcast then with someone who's a ball of fun and simply out to help her clients achieve wellness. Kalyn is a 2009 graduate of Palmer College of Chiropractic and has opened and operated back in line family Chiropractic and Wellness in Hiawatha, Iowa since that time, her area of practice focuses on acute care chiropractic with an emphasis in active release tech.

graston acupuncture and trigger point dry needling. She has met a fellow of anti aging regenerative and functional medicine since 2013. She focused a special attention in teen and women's health with mostly clinical lab baseline measurements and wellness monitoring. She is co founder of the e commerce supplement company well labs and she and her husband Tyler have two awesome children order age eight and Cooper age five. Let's get into the episode.

Thank you for joining me for another episode of the longevity blueprint podcast. The topic for today is beyond the snap crackle pop. And my guest today is Dr. Kelly Jane clean. She goes by CJ so I may be calling her that through this podcast. I'm super excited to have her on because she has a wonderful friend who actually wrote the foreword on my book your longevity blueprint and chapter two. If you haven't read it should read it. It's all about musculoskeletal a nervous system health. And this is a section of the book where I highlight chiropractic care and all of what it has done for me. I am a huge believer, huge fan of chiropractic care. I see CJ and naturally I wanted to have her

On the show. So welcome Dr. Calvin clean. Thank you for being here.

Dr. Calla Jayne Kleene 2:03

Thank you for having me. So tell me a little bit about what chiropractic care is and what you do. Yeah, so chiropractic care is this wonderful study of health from, there's a phrase called above down inside out in the chiropractic jargon, and we believe health comes from within, and God created our body to heal itself. We sweat when we're hot. We shiver when we're cold. And we just have these innate abilities that we believe with Chiropractic and stain and align that it just helps optimal function from a variety of from a variety of parameters really, from a whole system, whole body approach. We help treat patients relieve pain relief ailments without the use of drugs. We use our hands and we use various tools that allow us to uniquely treat each and every individual patient. Wonderful. Well, we titled this podcast

Dr. Stephanie Gray 3:00

Beyond the snap, crackle pop because I think some individuals have a minimal minimalist perspective on what chiropractic care really can do for them. But I want to address the snap crackle pop. So first what is happening when you get adjusted in you hear that that popping sound? It can kind of be scary. So what's happening? Yeah, yeah. You know to a lot of people are terrified of that, or they've seen a crazy YouTube video. I mean, I've seen some of these videos and they terrify me so it doesn't have to be. chiropractic has this big range of very low velocity low fours to crazy what I would even consider it looks traumatic. So a big range of how we can treat our patients but a lot of times the snap or the crackle I personally like receiving it as a patient but it's called a cavitation. And really is what it is when we put pressure on those joints spaces in the spine. It's a cavitation it's a release of pressure, it's relieved

Unknown Speaker 4:00

have oxygen, nitrogen and carbon dioxide. So that's why a lot of people like oh my gosh, I just had this great euphoric feeling post adjustment. It's that release of pressure that's been building up and this fine. Same thing happens when we crack our knuckles. It's just not as epic that we as chiropractors like to treat when we treat the spine. Why like that I it can be kind of scary when you hear lots of pops, but I do I just feel this release. I just, I feel better. Yeah. In the study that you know, just the endorphin release post adjustment that gives you that euphoria. But again, not every time do we need to necessarily hear the hear that cavitation the nice crap. There's been times when I'm adjusting patience, and I can feel it move. But it doesn't give you that. You know, it's kind of for me as a chiropractor is wildly satisfying to hear that. But I would also encourage patients, you know, that's been one of the things that's holding them back, my sister in law, she lives in Washington State and like, even when she hears strangers cracking their knuckles like it

Unknown Speaker 5:00

makes her entire body just get chills like she just hates the sound of it. Well, for her sake, I don't want to say hey, then don't go to a chiropractor just find a chiropractor who does low fours that you don't necessarily have to hear those snaps in the crackles. But again, I love it. I love delivering that for patients. But chiropractic shouldn't be a one size fits all you talk about this in your book that, you know, your approach to functional medicine is very far from a cookie cutter approach. And it has to be down to the individual. So I'm sure it is very affirming and satisfying when you when you hear that. But But expand on what you just mentioned. You said there are different chiropractors with different techniques. So what's the low? You mentioned? A low, low force, low force, what is that? What What is that? So, so it's one of those things that I can't speak to the volume because I don't practice it on a daily basis. That there is so in the chiropractic realm. It can be hyper specialized, based on the technique that the chiropractor likes to deliver to

Unknown Speaker 6:00

We're all biased to what we do and practice day in and day out. We think it's the best and my honest opinion. It's not the best for everyone, one of my really good friends. She was coming into me and her muscles were really tight and ragged, and I work on a lot of muscles. And she would tell me, she's like, hey, every day, I feel great after I leave your office, but the next day, I've never come back. I got a chiropractic hangover. And I was like, Whoa, timeout.

Unknown Speaker 6:27

Yeah, you know, I had never really heard of it either. But that's how she described it. And I was like, well, that's no fun. You didn't have the party last night to feel this awful today. And so I encourage you to go down the road to a friend of mine who practices a very low force. So typically, like again, back to this range. You know, if we have a very gentle and when I talk gentle, some people might think, did they even do anything? They just laid their hands on my body. I barely even felt any force. For some people. It's really powerful and really profound. So she started to go this low force chiropractor and there's a lot

Unknown Speaker 7:00

techniques in that realm, activator is one of the more common ones that it's like a little clipper. And even that setting can have from a very low force to a, you know, stronger force. But compared to what I do, on a scale of zero to 10, zero being like the most gentle like puff of air force compared to some of these YouTube videos where it looks like they're getting Jackie Chan, if you will. I'm probably like a 567 kind of range, but low horse again, just very, very gentle. And it can be very specific. And again, my friend, she in town, she gets like the deepest massage therapists to just beat the heck out of her muscles. But from a chiropractic perspective, her body responds so much quicker, faster, and she holds her therapy is so much longer on that lower force chiropractic. I think that's one of the things that I respect about you the most is that you know when to refer patients out and I want to get more to that later. But I want to come back to my book because

Unknown Speaker 8:00

In chapter two, I mentioned a quote, I actually open every chapter with a quote and BJ Palmer, who he started chiropractic, Palmer School of chiropractic, is that correct? He's the second generation DD Palmer started it and he's the son of DD Palmer. Got it and we live in Iowa. And that's where this chiropractic colleges. So after that a shout out to we're both from Iowa have to shout out to Palmer. And that's where you went correct? Yes. for school? Yes. Yeah. So the quote that I mentioned in the book is that medicine is the study of disease and what causes men to die. And chiropractic is the study of health and what causes men to live. And I think that is so true. Because many times with medicine, I feel like we're just prescribing a pill for an ill. And with chiropractic care, I feel like that's what's like you mentioned helping release the nitric oxide and energizing us and really helping support all of our organ systems. And I know I previously had very, very stressed state. my nervous system was

Unknown Speaker 9:00

It was just in that fight or flight state and I needed to go to the chiropractor, you very frequently, I can stretch my appointments out a little further now, but I felt so just jazzed up and I needed to get adjusted to help calm down my nervous system. So that's just one example one testimony of how I've benefited from chiropractic care. I truly believe in this care, I almost went to chiropractic school myself. And I ended up going down the nurse practitioner route, which is great because now I do have the option of integrating or combining, you know, natural medicine, with conventional medicine and working with providers like you who provide, I guess we would call it more alternative care, but we need to offer our patients all of these options because I think that that gives them the best of all worlds combined that can help them live a better life a healthier life. So I believe that all my patients should be seeing a chiropractor and I'm not even correct. So what what do you think what would you say to someone who thinks they don't need chiropractic care? Like I wasn't having joint pain

Unknown Speaker 10:00

muscle pains. I was just stressed out my nervous system was in this fight or flight state. And that's how I personally benefited. I didn't have an acute injury or back pain, whatnot. So what would you say to someone who thinks they may not need chiropractic care? Or maybe not everyone needs it? What's your opinion on that? Yeah, you know, I think at any stage in the game

Unknown Speaker 10:20

of life, you know, from the little sub babies to geriatric population, everybody can benefit but again, like you said, you came in and you didn't necessarily had pain. You know, from an energy standpoint, you felt that there was an energy black and so when we look at our nervous system, we have the parasympathetic, you know, rest and digest and fight or flight. So parasympathetic, sympathetic, and they go back and forth. So a lot of times, it's just the reset that we adjust in that mid back that T spine and it just kind of helps the system. Reset, if you will, but back do I think does everybody Yeah. My Yogi's my really discipline patients that

Unknown Speaker 11:00

practice yoga, that are very strong, but also flexible. They rarely need to come in, they are honoring their body, they're putting it through movements and motions. And me personally, I've walked into yoga class, feeling that I needed that adjustment. And I spend the time and work on my body and I walk out and like I freed that up, you know, that I was able to do on my own. But I know some of my manual labor workers, they put a lot of wear and tear on their body or our endurance athletes and triathletes, they literally physically are putting more miles on their body. Personally, I do feel when they come in, we see the joint restrictions, we see the muscle tension, they need to get adjusted a little bit more frequently. So it really again comes back down to the individual on what is their treatment plan look like?

Unknown Speaker 11:46

I have a person I hadn't seen it three years pop in the other day. Just keep their neck doing something you know, nothing impressive, but they came to their neck. And I teased him. I said, Hey, I'll see you again in three years when you feel like you need it, but

Unknown Speaker 12:00

My husband, I always loved telling the story of how he got introduced to chiropractic. I was in chiropractic school and I said, Hey, I need you to get adjusted. And he looked at me and he goes, I have no back pain or neck pain. And I said, babe, you want this to work out, you're going to get adjusted. And he was terrified. He said, What are you? What are you worried about? He goes, Well, once you start going to chiropractor, you have to go through the rest of your life. And I kind of had to sit with that for a little bit. And I'm like, you know, it was such a good point. And I see his point on two sides. I mean, a lot of times there are crooks in the chiropractic field. There's crooks in any healthcare field in any profession, that they say I want you to come once a week for the rest of your life and give me $5,000 up front and, and this is not everybody. I'm not trying to say

Unknown Speaker 12:44

that there's a lot of us but but they do exist.

Unknown Speaker 12:47

And then, you know, on the other side of that, Tyler is a perfect example. He didn't know how good he could feel and you know, he said, right after you got to Jesse's like, I didn't know my next move like that.

Unknown Speaker 13:00

And then you know, to then the next morning, he was like, I didn't know I could sleep that good. And that hard and he didn't know what he'd been missing out. So it's kind of cool that I've seen him morph into a better understanding and better connection to his body, because it just he just wouldn't didn't know. So I always encourage people like, Hey, give it a shot, don't wait necessarily until you have pain.

Unknown Speaker 13:20

Usually, that's what drives people to come see you that there's, you know, in your case, what I witnessed is that people, there's two, you have two different types of patients. One, the patient who's tried everything, the traditional medical models failed them, and they're like, I'm willing to do whatever it takes helped me and then there's other patients that come to you that they just align with. I want to figure out what's wrong. And I want the data and the labs to show me what it is I need. I don't want to just go to the doctor. Instead, they tell me Oh, it sounds like you have depression. I have nothing to be depressed about. But I do feel depressed. You know, and so you are their investigator and say, hey, let's dig into this and let's get to the uniqueness of you. Someone with Kira.

Unknown Speaker 14:00

It's just you don't have to necessarily wait until there's an ailment, but really kind of do the research and find a chiropractor. Ask your friends, who do you trust, who have you been to? Who do you feel has good ethics and good integrity. If I don't feel like I have pain or an ailment, I need to connect with somebody to, you know, be another portal have a team player total health package.

Unknown Speaker 14:22

I like that total health package. And in my book, I talk a lot about building a healthier body. And so the second step in building a healthier body, I believe, is seeing a chiropractor getting your joints and your muscles and your spine, everything in line so that your other organ systems can work effectively. So let's go back to what an adjustment is. Can you tell me if someone comes into your office so when you're offering is it called a manipulation? How do you how do you treat a patient and then we'll talk about other than the adjustments, some other modalities you offer in your office. You're kind of a triple threat you you offer so much, but let's focus on what an adjustment or manipulation is. So

Unknown Speaker 15:01

Since you said on the degree of severity, you know from zero to 10, you're more of 567. So if someone has never been to a chiropractor before, what is an adjustment? What can they expect? Yeah, so it really again depends on the type of chiropractor that they see for their first visit.

Unknown Speaker 15:18

There's there's a couple different types of varying degrees of chiropractor. So when I was in chiropractic schools, like you said, I went to Davenport Palmer College and I was where chiropractic started in 1985, or 1895, excuse me as a senior X ray was founded, but very traditional chiropractors who I have some of my best friends in the chiropractic world practice very traditionally, where I practice on the opposite end of the spectrum. So in our lingo, we call it your you know, a traditionalist, a straight A straight chiropractor, or what I am is a mixer. And you know, I always joke in school that I'm a dirtiest mixer, and I love it all. So nutrition. We got thoughts traumas, toxins, and

Unknown Speaker 16:00

I like to address all of them, you know with it.

Unknown Speaker 16:04

So I'll speak to that but I really want to honor the traditionalist chiropractors. It's what led me to chiropractic school and some in some respects that you go in you get an X ray, you get an analysis very specific analysis on the X ray, where we look for degrees of rotation ladder ality it's a really cool evaluation when we do look at those x rays. And then they develop a treatment plan based on those x rays, as you want your mind to be in line, right. I mean, you want your spine you don't want. Yeah, you mean you want your spine to be in line on that X ray, right? So you're looking for for a general person who doesn't have a lot of training in the medical field. You don't want any of those vertebrae to be, you know, shifted to the side whatnot, because that can impinge a nerve and cause pain. So you're looking for any abnormalities on that X ray? Yeah, and those chiropractor So Dr. ganz dead, he developed a method and they run like a nervous scope up and down the spine and it's nervous scope 10

Unknown Speaker 17:00

detects temperature differences. So again, it's more diagnostics for the clinician at the time that the patient comes in, or when they see that there's a subluxation based on the X ray analysis, and then they see a temperature difference. That's when they know to adjust when and where, where the opposite kind of end of the spectrum and how I practice is based on motion based on muscle tension. And in the gods stead, or the straight firefighters, they do motion analysis to but again, they go back to where do they see the subluxation on the X ray?

Unknown Speaker 17:32

Again, because some of the stuff that we do we conflict but where I'm at as a chiropractor doesn't mean that mine is the best and there's the worst and vice versa. Every patient has to find and navigate what works well for them and build a relationship. I'm really big on like, Do you trust this person? You have a relationship with them. It's a very intimate relationship. We touch our patients every single day during all this Coronavirus stuff. You know a lot of people are really terrified and one of the things I'm so grateful is I still get a physical

Unknown Speaker 18:00

Touch my patience, which I think is really important. I had a patient come in, he was sitting at his work desk and had his feet up on the desk and the phone rang and it startled him and his feet. He like jumped up and felt a huge pop and then an intense amount of pain. And they had to drag him to the hospital and because he was in so much pain, and it was probably I think, 10 or 11 o'clock at night, so I wasn't open. And the next day, his wife, his poor wife is carrying a man and they're like, we got muscle relaxers and pain pills and we're dying. We need to figure something out. I lay him facedown on the table. When I lift up a shirt. I wanted to see what his back look like and he's got three perfect black and blue spots and it looks right where his transverse processes should be. And I said today X ray your back and he kind of looks at me and his wife and he goes they didn't even touch me, huh? Yeah, quit to prescribe.

Unknown Speaker 19:00

The painkillers without any physical assessment. Yeah, yeah. And he was visible. I mean, yeah, you know, honestly, I'm kind of glad they prescribed him he was in so much pain but because he literally had three fractures in his spine.

Unknown Speaker 19:12

And so it's just one of those things like I feel very fortunate we get to touch our patients. So anyway, I don't need to tangent there. But I want to assess the motion through active range of motion and through static palpation when they're laying facedown on the table and find where those joint restrictions are. I have a lot of great colleagues that think that that's reckless, they don't like that I don't take an X ray before a just a patient, but we listen to the health history, we make sure that there's nothing alarming. That would indicate Hey, before I adjust, like that patient that I just mentioned, who had three fractures, he was so symptomatic, and I'm like I am so sorry to do this, but I should not treat you until we get a look at that X ray so we know what we're dealing with. I had a roofer who he fell off the roof and landed on his feet. And four days later, he's in my office with just massive pain but I just I didn't like the sound of it and he did get a compression for

Unknown Speaker 20:00

And is fine. So we do our due diligence when x ray is definitely matches the health history, we'll run that X ray.

Unknown Speaker 20:07

And we have good results. If we didn't have good results, we wouldn't still be in practice today. So

Unknown Speaker 20:13

there's so many different ways that we can evaluate the spine. So again, it just comes back down to the provider and the chiropractors training and just the techniques that they provide. You have the skills, it sounds like to obviously palpate your patient and determine where they need that adjustment, but the wisdom to send them for an X ray if needed. Yeah, something that you've mentioned to me multiple times. What's the saying that you say? There's 500? chiropractors, 500 different know that? Yeah, the great thing about chiropractic, there's over 200 techniques and philosophies out there. The bad thing about chiropractic there's over 10 or techniques and philosophies out there, the good and the bad. Yeah. Well beyond getting an adjustment. I think what what partially is helped us I think become such good friends. We just have a similar way of thinking you

Unknown Speaker 21:00

offer more than the snap, crackle pop. And that's again kind of why I titled the podcast this that's so important and I want to hear that snap, crackle pop. But what do you offer in your office beyond the adjustment I think that really strengthens the care you can provide to your patient. So what else do you offer there? Other what other tools and techniques do you have? Yeah, so beyond, beyond the snap, crackle pop, which again, that's like my backbone, literally, it's my foundation of how I became a healthcare provider.

Unknown Speaker 21:29

And again, you are the one that really introduced me to a whole nother set of tools from the functional medicine standpoint, but as it pertains to musculoskeletal care, I do a technique called active release technique. It's really an assessment of the muscles releasing lead to adhesions and trigger points that we can develop in between nerves and muscles. So when we look to the spine, about 80%, of our body's musculature attaches to the spine in one way or another, so basically, shoulder down we have 80% of our musculature in our torso

Unknown Speaker 22:00

So those responsible for so much of our motion attaches back to the spine. So our goal is that if we can treat the muscle ligament tendon nerve at the same time we treat the bone our bias is that we feel better quicker and then hopefully stay and maintain that adjustment longer. I always tell my patients they have better things to be doing than sitting in my office all the time. And my ego I mean our egos like we want to get our patients better and fast and back and you know, doing their normal routines and not having to rely on us from the acute care we love. I love wellness patients like when you come in, it's like oh my gosh, I love it. Just I check your spine. I just you know, we catch up, and you're on your way. Like that's actually my favorite, but so much of our patients. They come in when there's an email that hey, I'm having headaches, I'm having migraines, I'm having back pain. So so much of us when we work with insurance companies that have to be medically necessary, it has to have a musculoskeletal pain, discomfort and numbness and tingling. So in that realm that's like what we call like the evidence based chiropractic.

Unknown Speaker 23:00

Now I have some patients that come to me only when they're constipated like CJ zero back pain, but I'm constantly when we look at you know, oh 405 that's one and we look how those nerves that lead that area of the spine has so much control over our reproductive organs and that lower gi we adjust their spine when they're out and their bowels get moving a joke with some of my friends is the post Cairo poop when you take your your little one to the chiropractor, so if you're if your child is constipated, and you've tried many things, what not magnesium obviously water and a belly massage, take them to the chiropractor that facilitated and I think what you and I get to see in practice is we have some very diligent patients who've taken their their kids to the chiropractor and they've done their their work on saying, okay, I've done the chiropractic thing, but they're still constipated or they're still bedwetting, you know, what am I missing and I think that's where you bring in so much from the functional medicine round of, let's look at this is a food allergy or food sensitivity. They're not digesting

Unknown Speaker 24:00

properly. So back to kind of the chiropractic, you know, blueprint, if you will thoughts, traumas, toxins, we can address some of the trauma to this spine, but if we're not eating something that's toxic to them, like maybe milk or gluten, or even something like a banana, you know, I, we've had kids come back with banana allergies or food intolerances, which really then can have a drastic effect. So the chicken or the egg, is that banette banana or dairy allergy creating the subluxation and it's fine, or is that spinal subluxation creating inflammatory response to the food sensitivity? Right? We don't know. But let's treat them both. Yeah, yeah. Totally. Oh, go back to the active release technique. So

Unknown Speaker 24:42

when you're adjusting patients, especially if they don't maybe hold their adjustment well, and correct me if I'm wrong here but is doing is offering that therapy that active release technique, Morgan to help them hold their adjustment better because you're addressing the muscles and the spine at the same time.

Unknown Speaker 25:00

Yeah, yeah, and you know, some of my patients, we get some referrals from the medical community and some of our patients are terrified, and some of their medical providers are terrified of the cervical manipulation. So we'll get a referral and they'll say, you know, no manipulation of the spine, or of the cervical spine, which we honor that we always have a discussion with the patient. And there's been a, you know, a couple instances where I'm like, Oh, my gosh, this, the main part of this is that, you know, that see, one vertebrae is so far out of the line that if I don't treat it, I'm only treating the patient 50% by just doing the HRT so I don't want to minimize the adjustment when it's necessary, but it's about respecting boundaries of patient preference, and I'll pick up the phone and call the provider and say, Hey, why are you concerned about this? And sometimes that dialogue is like, hey, there's a family history of vascular patency where they're, you know, having an abdominal aortic aneurysm which is very scary and so they don't want rotation of that spine. And that's a very odd concern. I think chiropractor should be talking about this a lot more about knowing when to

Unknown Speaker 26:00

Just knowing when not to adjust, so we'll get some patients that have significant rotation injury or injuries, or excuse me significant rotation restriction. So this kind of range of motion, but they're terrified of the adjustment. So I've been able to fully restore functional range of motion with just doing HRT and not even manipulating the spine. So that's kind of nice. In my realm of I have multiple tools that I don't fit for some reason it's contraindicated to adjust the patient, we can do the arty. Another technique I do is graston, which we call the shiny the shiny butter knives. That smell like chocolate. Yeah, expand on that. Yeah, so the grasping tools, again, it's just an literally another tool that addresses the fascial adhesions, the muscle spasm so fashion, is like this clip like cellophane or cling wrap when it gets tight. You have to really work to pull it apart. Well, adhesions develop on our muscles from overuse from poor posture, repetitive motion, so so much of what we can do is I can adjust the spine and then when I go in and treat that fascia, we get more people

Unknown Speaker 27:00

pain relief. And like you said, the goal is that they hold their adjustment longer if I just adjust the spine, and don't tackle that adhesions and those those factual releases, in my opinion where we could do more to minimize treatment office visits and time

Unknown Speaker 27:17

I, up here in the occiput. And to see one, there's so much really crucial musculature that is really creating a lot of headaches and migraines. And so I love being able to treat both of those and get way better outcomes. But again, it comes down to like the provider if I had a patient that comes in and they tried five other chiropractors who practice very similar to how I practice, but maybe they didn't get the graston or the air tea or we do acupuncture, we do trigger point needling. So we don't want to keep doing what they've already done, you know, and so really, it comes down to the provider saying what have you done, what worked, what didn't work? And every once in a while, you know, stuff you said, You sent me a patient that had a medical file, like

Unknown Speaker 28:00

Just pages and pages that this poor woman had been everywhere. And I pulled up her MRI that she had on a CD and I pulled it up and her see two vertebrae so it's supposed to sit like this and see one sits around it and it rotates like a doughnut around that see to her see to seriously look 45 degrees tilted and I looked at her as a girlfriend, I am so sorry, I need you to go to a different chiropractor. Who does Upper Cervical so my friend down the road practices Atlas orthogonal. I said I want you to start with her and I thought my friend Maggie was just going to have to see her seriously like 100 times for how awful that see to look. And I got an email from that patient probably three weeks later and said Maggie has changed my life. But in my professional opinion, there's no way I would have been able to get to that level of specificity that doctor maybe did, because I just did it practice that technique. So really, again, I think it really comes down to provider to really look at the patient from the whole picture of saying, what is it that I think you need and sometimes I'm wrong

Unknown Speaker 29:01

Sometimes I have been humbled and underestimate the power of what I do. It's just a tool. I'm just a mechanic, that the body is the healer, I just really worked to put the tires rotated in the right spot. So there's times where I'm like, man, there's something crazy going on with this patient, I just adjust the spine and maybe put two acupuncture needles in or do a little bit of soft tissue. And the patient says, this was a game changer. And it humbles me just to the power of when the body is alive and the nervous system is working. Just how sometimes the simplest things when we have super complex patients can make a profound effects long term. Absolutely. So let's talk about some examples. You mentioned headaches, that you have been able to help patients with. Let's talk about some other examples. Maybe some unique cases, like I know I had I had no idea about some of the techniques that you offered in your office until I started sending your patients and started learning about how much you can help so I when I think of grass that

Unknown Speaker 30:00

graston technique and its benefits, I think of patients who have tendinitis. So like golfers or they have golfer's elbow or tennis elbow athletes who have have injuries or who have tendon issues, I think of your technique as being able to really break down scar tissue. Is that correct? Or fashio? You were just talking about fascia. So can you obviously this is not my forte. So can you expand on for our listener, some complaints, they may be having that these services, these techniques could help. So like tendinitis, carpal tunnel, plantar fasciitis, some of those things that, that these therapies could help that they may be totally unaware of and didn't realize how much they were missing out. Yeah, well, until I think, sometimes even my own patients, they'll say, Oh, yeah, you know, I've got this case of plantar fasciitis and I've been treating their headaches and said, Hey, you never mentioned you know that before. And they're like, Yeah, because you're the back doctor.

Unknown Speaker 30:54

And some people, they, you know, some chiropractors they don't want to touch the feet. They don't want to deal with carpal tunnel. They just want to just

Unknown Speaker 31:00

their spine and that's fine. But again, when we work so much like so, plantar fasciitis, the bottom of the feet and cadaver labs, we've literally been able to trace the fascia from the bottom of the feet through the back of the Achilles all the way up the hamstrings, all the way to the C one vertebrae, like that's just how much actual connections Wow, there's some pretty cool YouTube videos where they explain what fascia is. There was some woman that gave a TED talk and she was a fashion expert. And she had this really cool body suit that she was able to pull the fashio up and then just to be able to see, you know, I don't know if you can see on my shirt here, but when you pull it and you twist it, that's what happens to fashion. So how does fashion get tight when we sit at our desk all day and doing this and fascia and all the musculature? Yeah, everyone starts sitting upright, but all of that fascia, it just tightens because we're in this position and posture all day long. This is also repetitive motion. We'll get tightening to the fascia to along the back and the rhomboids to do one of these things. But then in front, it just gets tighter.

Unknown Speaker 32:00

tighter. And so we can work with the techniques to be able to open up at the bottom of the feet. I like treating plantar fascia because one it's so debilitating to it really does impact patients gait. So what I mean by that is they get up in the morning and they're their feet, just a and they kill and they look like the tin man and tin woman getting out of bed. That changes their gait and how they hunched down, and they're prostrate, it's gonna mess up their back long term. So I like treating plantar fascia and the acute case, when it's brand new meaning zero to three months. Usually we knock it out in about three to six visits. The chronic cases, we always aim for less is more, but some of those chronic cases take a multifactorial, more multifaceted approach just because they've had it for so long, that we can't just focus on the feet that we really have to include up the gap Achilles into the hamstring.

Unknown Speaker 32:56

But we do a combination of the graston the LRT and then

Unknown Speaker 33:00

people hated that trigger point dry needling. I tried to do that last to see if we can get everything else cleared out. But if I don't, I always apologize because it's not pleasant. I mean, it's one of the worst techniques that I hate to deliver. But I love the results they get. Yeah, they may hate it for two seconds, but then they love you five seconds later. Yeah. And usually not five seconds later, I always tell them the next day they might hate me and want to

Unknown Speaker 33:28

call me yelling at in an email or through a text because they might feel way worse. Just with the feet in the biomechanics of the feet. I can't tell a patient they stay off your feet. So usually sometimes the very first 24 hours they absolutely hate me but then follow the next day. They're like, holy cow, it starts to feel a lot better. Well, I've just heard an incredible testimonies. I haven't had that done on my feet. I've had it done I think on my pecs you've because I get so tight here from sitting like this. Well, and pecs feels a lot more pleasant compared to

Unknown Speaker 33:58

make sense. Yeah. I hope

Unknown Speaker 34:00

I want to come in for the plantar fascia. I hope so do I know I've had patients throughout the years have surgery scheduled for carpal tunnel syndrome, and I and I say please just go see my friends, please go see Dr. CJ, and they have canceled their surgeries. I mean, not that this therapy, we can't promise that is going to prevent everyone from you know, ever needing surgery. But I know these patients have been extremely thankful that before they went under the knife, they at least tried at least explored some other options, and you were very effective for them. So I thank you for that. Yeah, well, you and I guess kind of to piggyback off that back to the functional medicine realm. I mean, when we steal the hands and we can find the nerve and trap mess. Typically, we'll know very quickly, like within that first visit, if we start getting we can recreate the very symptoms that they have. It means that we're on the right structure and the right anatomy that's creating the pinch in the house. Think about that way. I mean, anytime we've got carpal tunnel, there's a nerve being pinched. So

Unknown Speaker 35:00

What they do surgically is they go in and cut the fascia so that the nerve can glide through there. And so our goal is that can we break through that fascia you know, and we got carpal tunnel symptom being trapped here, all the way you know from the elbow to parts of the in the shoulder and the musculature here, here, all the way into the neck, but they might not have any pain, nerve pain here, the pain might just be in the back of the hand. So even sometimes just doing that action will really flare people up. Well, how do we type all day? It's in that action. So we can start by treating in the hand but you know, good clinician, we're supposed to find it a kinetic chain. However, back to the functional medicine, thoughts, traumas, toxins, sometimes this is gluten intolerance. Mm hmm. Yeah. What's contributing to inflammation throughout the entire body? Well, likely something you're eating Yeah, is undiagnosed autoimmunity. You know, when we can feel that there's just a lot of sticky swelling and inflammation in between the muscle bellies and it's like, okay, we're not, and that's where it comes. Is the patient willing and able to go down that route of exploring you know, you

Unknown Speaker 36:00

For diagnostic testing, or are we just going to go and create a surgery that will give them relief in a lot of the time it will not get to the root cause of the problem because that gluten their eating is could lead to auto an autoimmune condition, it could be also the cause of other symptoms they're having that they haven't put the dots together yet on. I mentioned earlier, and I would get back to one thing that I appreciate about you is knowing when to refer patients out. And so you do send us a lot of patients when you say, hey, this patient's retaining a lot of fluid, something's going on. You may refer us a patient to explore if even something like mold, mold toxin could contributing to them retaining this fluid or I know you sent a lot of patients out to eliminate it lymphatic drainage specialists to help the patient literally get rid of some of the fluid. So I think that's that's one of your office's strengths also is that you know when to refer patients out when to who to refer them to. I know you've also had you have two children, two beautiful, very blonde children. You can kind of see behind her

Unknown Speaker 37:00

In the pictures actually a little bit older now, I should update them. But

Unknown Speaker 37:05

you had a very humbling experience with the birth of your second child, your son, that has taught you a lot in life, the lessons that you carry through your practice. So do you want to tell us just briefly kind of what that experience was like for you? Yeah, yeah, it's I can I love to tell it. Because my my firstborn daughter, her name is Porter and she was born on Leap Day. So just a unique soul, literally from day one. And she starts Lee and I hate to admit this in front of like new moms, but she was sleeping through the night like at two weeks, and I just had this like, glow of last night. My 14 month old was awake.

Unknown Speaker 37:46

I know. I know, but I did. I had what I call it an innocent ignorance. Because I had it and I was glowing with the innocent ignorance of Well, yes, because she's getting Chiropractic and she's getting breast fed. And I'm the

Unknown Speaker 38:00

Best mom and I'm doing all these worlds.

Unknown Speaker 38:03

And that's why she's sleeping through the night. And then

Unknown Speaker 38:07

so here I am, in my full on being great mom. Three years later, my son comes and he was born on January 1.

Unknown Speaker 38:17

First baby of the new year is the weirdest birthdays for my kids. And the news always shows up. They said you just had the first baby of the year will you be on the news or you just had to leave date? It's like, all the times you want to be on the news? It's not after you've just had a baby.

Unknown Speaker 38:30

But yeah, so Cooper came on January 1, and that child was hospitalized six times, five times before his six months,

Unknown Speaker 38:38

six months of life and he was sick with all these respiratory viruses and he wouldn't fever which is a chiropractor like manda fever, the fever is what kills the virus. So the fact that he wasn't a brain was really kind of messing with me. And it made no sense because I was doing everything even better than what I done with my firstborn. And so I kind of think God humbled me with respect to a child.

Unknown Speaker 39:00

You can do everything right and still not be. And you know, the humbling reality of like, we're not in control and stuff. I know you've seen patients that they're doing the work, they're doing the diligence, they're doing the labs, they're doing the supplements, they're changing the lifestyle, and we're not getting the outcomes. And it's frustrating. And I think that's when we have to remember like the true healer and the true, the true power, what made the body heals the body. And so I needed that my son Cooper's experience to be humbled that you can do everything right and still go wildly wrong, but in short, he is healthy. He is I tell people use and vinegar now. It was really a humbling experience. In a short he was we don't know why but he was having massive kidney stones, which is very bizarre for babies and infants. He was clogging catheters because he had so many stones but after that June visit down at the University of Iowa, we had a great experience and a great team there.

Unknown Speaker 40:00

He's kind of a miracle. We don't know what caused it and why it stopped. But I'm grateful. But I needed that I needed to be humbled as a patient when you're so vulnerable for somebody to help you that you'll do anything. But also, you know, on the flip side of the realm of our own personal responsibility to take care of ourselves, eat a good diet, because I don't want to have to rely on the medical system again, not that I don't trust it, I have a lot of faith in it. But just that level of vulnerability of when you feel so awful and so helpless, that there's a very uncomfortable feeling, but I needed to go through it. I'm grateful that I had friends like you. There was a couple other friends in town that I you know, health care providers that I could lean on and text ideas and to help find Cooper. Yeah, well, thank God he is a healthy adorable baby boy now. And I think what I love seeing when not that I ever love to see a friend or a family member suffer but what I do love to see come out of it is just how the appreciation that you have for the suffering and what has come out of that and what

Unknown Speaker 41:00

Now you can empathize differently with patients. So I'm but I'm mostly just happy to know that he is doing well.

Unknown Speaker 41:08

What is one thing that you cannot live with every day? Like what's what's something that's very important to you that you can't go without? Oh, on the health spectrum like loose what is one of your unhealthy addictions?

Unknown Speaker 41:21

I know that the addiction, you know, you'd send me the email you're like, what's the one thing that you do for longevity? Or what's this I'm like man, Stephanie, my ATD I am not a pattern habitual person. My husband on the other side like he has the same routine. He gets up in the morning he goes to the bathroom, he brushes his smashes his hand brushes his teeth and jumps in the shower and like he does it in a very like orderly pattern and I am so not like that. So to answer the question, what is the one thing I do daily is probably I don't do the same thing every day.

Unknown Speaker 41:54

I should have said our weekly What's something that you do weekly for yourself? Yeah. Are you ready?

Unknown Speaker 42:00

I mean, I think and again, this is just maybe the current moment, but the prayer, the meditation,

Unknown Speaker 42:07

the daily, weekly, I mean, it might not be

Unknown Speaker 42:10

as long as it should, but it's definitely there in the daily routine. But I'm big on journaling, and goal setting. I think in realms of longevity, we all need to know what we're working on and towards every whenever we're at a conference or whatnot. I know you always have your book or in your purse, you're always write things down and, and goals are what like 90% more likely to be accomplished if you write them down. So that's partially why you've accomplished so much because you're writing them down. So

Unknown Speaker 42:39

audience listeners take that. take that to heart. It's me, let me ask you, what's yours? What do you what is one thing that you can't live without ever? That's part of your routine? You probably wouldn't like my answer. When I think of one thing I couldn't live without. I immediately want to say air conditioning.

Unknown Speaker 42:55

I'm always a warm I need I need air conditioning. I'll say this because of the next question that I was going

Unknown Speaker 43:00

ask you something that you do daily to support your immune system. I am pretty habitual about my supplements. I just, that's just part of my routine. So something that I do every single morning is I wake up if William's not up, I go out to the kitchen and I'm taking my supplements. So right now silver is something that I love taking I usually take it through flu season, I was kind of lacks, I kind of latched on it January, February, but then in March started taking it again. So I am fully habitual about taking my supplements like I if I don't take them I it causes anxiety.

Unknown Speaker 43:33

That is something that I do daily. But I think prayer and meditation is more than taking the supplements. That's something also especially as I'm feeding William and rocking them to sleep at night. That's kind of my part time for him pray over, you know, business and family and then that's, that's the time that I have right now to do that. So that's also part of my routine. But what do you do to support your immune system or what is a tip for the viewers, the listeners on Immune Support? Yeah, I know

Unknown Speaker 44:00

One of the things that I, I feel really passionately about, especially with what you and I are seeing just in our patients movement

Unknown Speaker 44:10

is reading our bodies were meant to move. We weren't meant to sit at a desk all day instead of computers.

Unknown Speaker 44:17

We were meant to move. And I think that movement

Unknown Speaker 44:20

from a longevity standpoint, I mean it circulates the blood, it cleanses the blood, sweat detoxes the body. So it doesn't have to be a crazy cardio workout every single day, but getting strong, maintaining strong so I'm a big firm believer if we're not moving, if we're not working out and sweating at least 20 to 30 minutes, four to five days a week. We're doing harm, and it doesn't cost anything. We can all do it with YouTube. And I mean there is so much free information out there literally at our fingertips, thanks to technology that we have no excuse not to move. Even just like the mindful motions of yoga.

Unknown Speaker 45:00

And, you know, there's Tai Chi and Qi Gong and even just something as simple as like bouncing on like those little trampolines just to get the body moving. And from an energy standpoint, so I'm a big believer in that. And thankfully, it was hard when I think as working moms Stephanie and you probably agree that the workouts, especially if you have a kid, and you're having to nurse them and then pump or if you're not pumping, and then you're changing diapers or doing laundry, and then you want to shower yourself that like the whole time to work out. You have to either be really, really diligent, but I did I fell off the wagon, you know, working out with probably four or five years of

Unknown Speaker 45:37

from the time that I got pregnant with my daughter, tell my son was having a second birthday workouts were not consistent in that part of it. And now, it's not about being fit for me working out. It's about the mental clarity that it gives me to burn off the adrenaline and get clear in my head for you. I totally agree. I used to go to yoga and through my pregnancy I went to yoga I just I needed that. So bad

Unknown Speaker 46:00

And I have really latched on that. And recently I just, especially with everything being closed, yes, you can access it online. So I just said, okay, William, we're doing yoga today in the basement and he was laughing at me and kind of looking at me and making faces like, you know, like, what are you doing, Mom, I just stretched and I let him kind of climb all over me. I got some yoga. And of course, it wasn't the most relaxing practice. But it still we were laughing together. It was a fun experience of not experiment, although it was an experiment on experience. And

Unknown Speaker 46:32

and that just kind of motivated me to say I think there's no reason why I can't be doing this every week. And so that's something that I am speaking out loud that I'm going to start incorporating again. And he's at the age now where I can leave and go to yoga. So when everything opens up, I look forward to getting back into that. But I love that your your your tip movement. I'm going to take that as your top longevity tip, which is wonderful. So where can viewers find you? Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 47:00

Yeah, my practice is called back online chiropractic. We're located in Hiawatha, Iowa just right next to Cedar Rapids in your practice we also have a website called my well labs that we have a supplement line similar to longevity blueprint. Those are your websites and you're on social media your businesses are on social media as well. Yeah, yeah. What are those two websites then? Yeah, my back end mind calm. And then my well labs calm wonderful. There's, I don't even remember like, Instagram might be at my back and mine. I'm not even sure it's embarrassing that I don't know that.

Unknown Speaker 47:33

You can follow my personal page which I mix personal professional all the time. I have no boundaries. That might be I don't know. But well, I'll get all those links from you. And we'll post all of that in the show notes. So please, please follow Dr. CJ clean on all of her social media accounts. CJ, this has been a total joy and I hope viewers do realize they are likely missing out on the benefits of chiropractic care and that they truly may not know how good they could feel if they can find and slowly

Unknown Speaker 48:00

A wonderful, good fit a chiropractor for their health. So thank you so much for always supporting me and thank you for your smile and the joy that you bring to all your patients and your contribution to this world. So thank you for being on as a guest today. Thank you for having me.

Dr. Stephanie Gray 48:16

See, I told you she was fun. I hope Dr. Clean has alleviated any fears you may have regarding seeing a chiropractor for the first time and also truly conveyed the benefits of chiropractic care is something I have received tremendous help from and I of course want that for you to

be sure to check out my book your longevity blueprint. And if you aren't much of a reader, you're in luck. You can now take my course online where I walk you through each chapter in the book. Plus for a limited time Not only is the course 50% off, but you also get your first consult with me for free. Check this offer out at your longevity blueprint comm and click the course tab. One of the biggest things you can do to support the show and help us reach more listeners is to subscribe to the show. And leave us a rating and review on Apple podcasts or wherever you listen. I read all of them.

reviews and would truly love to hear your suggestions for show topics, guests, or how you're applying what you've learned on the show to create your own longevity blueprint. The podcast is produced by the team at counterweight creative. As always, thanks so much for listening and remember, wellness is waiting.

The information provided in this podcast is educational. No information provided should be considered to be or used as a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. Always consult with your personal medical authority.